#izzy being the anchor is an interpretation

[something-about-sunflowers]

On symbolism in OFMD (And like. Understanding what is LITERALLY spelled out for us?)

Stede - The Lighthouse (textual - explicit)

Mary - The Lighthouse (textual - implicit/by association)

Ed - The Kraken (textual - explicit)

Izzy - The Anchor (interpretive - implicit)

Stede (and Mary, by association) is represented by The Lighthouse. From his wedding, to his impending death, to his return to sea. 'We are to be lighthouses to each other', 'It's a lighthouse, I should have been one for my family [. . .] We need to be a lighthouse', [arm up like a signal to his marooned crew]. These are textually explicit instances of symbolism. He is helping guide his crew towards better lives, he is doing the same for Ed, and he is also the thing that causes them all to crack up on the rocks and sink to the depths that The Kraken inhabits.

Ed is represented by The Kraken. From the implicit fear/respect of everyone who knows of him, to his murdering his father, to his 'murdering' Lucius/maiming Izzy/marooning and kidnapping Stede's crew. 'The kraken didn't kill my dad, I did, I'm the kraken', 'I am the kraken' [self affirmingly before he goes to maim Izzy]. These are textually explicit instances of symbolism. The kraken was often drawn on maps/charts to represent dangerous waters. It is a warning against danger but it is also a form of protection. Ed embodies the kraken when he is hurt. He kills his father to protect himself/his mother. He 'kills' Lucius and maims Izzy and maroons most of the crew to protect himself from the hurt that Stede caused when he left and from the consequences of what continuing to show his vulnerability might lead to if Izzy is right (which he is, outside of The Revenge at least) and if he doesn't have Izzy in his corner anymore. He is hurt and he brings everyone he can down into the depths with him.

Izzy is the anchor. From his desire for stability, his aversion to change, his desire to protect what is important to him (himself, Ed, and HIS crew through the reputation of Blackbeard). 'Bored as you might be, if we don't come up with a plan soon, we're all gonna fucking die', 'Your lot's days of lying around doing fuck all are through. Starting today you're all going to be getting specific duties', 'Bonnet's done something to my bosses brain', '[mid resignation rant] losing several of our crew', 'I'm not dying. Not for him and not for you', 'loyalty to your captain, above all else [. . .] I couldn't sit by and let you ruin yourself for that twat', [is tied to an anchor by a crew that don't like him as captain because of the way he enforces the norm that he inhabited as a pirate (which Fang and Ivan ALSO inhabited before The Revenge, and which Fang returns to once Blackbeard/The Kraken is the one enforcing it again)]. These are interpretive instances of symbolism. Anchors keep a ship safe but they also keep it unmoving. Izzy wants the normalcy and security of Ed's Blackbeard (who people surrender to on sight, which means no danger) but Ed finds that life boring because there is no challenge and there is no change. He goes down with the ship when it cracks up on the rocks and he is content in the depths because that is what is familiar to him. He does not know that iron rusts.

And nobody is a molotov cocktail.

Except for Wee John. Wee John can be a molotov cocktail.

[uselessheretic]

I don't believe the issue people have with the idea of Izzy being Ed's abuser is because fans are unwilling to view Ed as a victim of abuse or Izzy as capable of being an abuser. I feel like it's a more simple answer of "people don't agree with that interpretation because there isn't enough to substantiate it."

With Izzy and Ed, it's important to understand the difference between conflict and abuse. (I'd highly recommend "Conflict is Not Abuse" by Sarah Schulman!) A lot of the time in highly volatile relationships, we're quick to assign abuse to them and to figure out which person is the perpetrator and who's the victim, but often times they're just conflicted. This is why you'll often hear Izzy stans describing their relationship as mutually toxic, not mutually abusive (which isn't real)

The simplest definition is determining whether the relationship is based in Power Struggle or Power Over. Abuse isn't based off of individual actions, but an exertion of power. Both Izzy and Ed commit acts as part of a power struggle towards each other, with Izzy's antagonism of Stede and utilization of the navy, and Ed's manipulation and physical violence of punching, choking, and mutilating. (Yes, physical violence is an expression of power!) There's a back and forth here with both having moments of forcing the other to stay, and neither of them being the picture of a healthy relationship. With them, there's also the added element of Izzy's privilege as a white man versus Ed's position as Izzy's boss which are both significant power imbalances that factor into each other's toxicity.

The important part is that Ed's feeling negatively towards Izzy doesn't equate to being an abuser. Izzy vaguely threatens Ed ("Edward better watch his fucking step") but this is also within a context where Ed just choked him. Izzy had called the navy before, yeah, but that option isn't available for him anymore, and Ed still has an advantage of being the only thing keeping the crew from throwing Izzy overboard with an anchor anklet. Arguably, Ed holds more power over Izzy in this specific instance. Rationally, there isn't an immediate threat here, but Ed still responds as if there is.

Ignoring all that, the main part of this is that Ed's Kraken response is indicative of the other person being an abuser. "If someone reminds Ed of his past abuse that much then it must mean that they're in the wrong!" But that's not how that works. Take this passage from Conflict is Not Abuse as an example:

This is also not how Trauma™️ responses functions. Ed, incontestably I hope, has some form of PTSD/c-PTSD. The very defining aspect of PTSD is that a person experiences a traumatic event that they continue to not recover from impacting their day to day life. Often people going through traumatic events will struggle for a bit before getting better, but not everyone does that. When the symptoms continue or even grow worse, that's when we identify PTSD.

PTSD reactions aren't rational. Especially when it comes to c-PTSD, the ability to gauge and respond to threats is damaged. You become easily triggered by things, often seemingly unrelated to an outsider, that reminds you of those traumatic experiences and throws you into survival mode. People with PTSD and who have suffered from abuse are not able to rely on gut instinct alone. That meter has been damaged where the threat alarm is going off at a hair trigger, leaving the survivor of trauma the options of avoiding those triggers completely (nearly impossible) or learning to suppress that. This can also leave survivors of abuse especially prone to revictimization. When every action someone takes looks like a red flag, you learn to tune out that alarm bell, including the times when it's not an overreaction.

If we assume that Ed reacting with the Kraken is indicative of the other person being an abuser, then that'd mean we'd have to assume that Stede's crew was a threat. Ed killed his dad and Ed killed Lucius, so naturally, Lucius must have been abusing Ed. You can extend it as far as Stede as well, since David Jenkins described Stede's rejection as "deranging" Ed, and Ed while acting as the Kraken is tossing out Stede's shit and marooning his playthings. But we know that Lucius only had the best of intentions for Ed, and we know that the crew is too incompetent to hurt Ed.

So what the fuck is going on with Ed?

Simple answer is that Ed feels threatened. Ed's scared. He doesn't feel safe. When chronically traumatized people feel unsafe, they react in defense, including in ways that are maladaptive to themselves, and harmful to others. One way to conceptualize it is through the Internal Family Systems (I wrote an analysis through this lens once!) Within IFS, you have two basic categories of Protectors and Exiles. Exiles are the part of us who hold the pain and shame of our trauma, usually from childhood. Protectors are the parts of us who develop strategies, usually maladaptive, to protect us from that pain. I'm severely simplifying, but I've found this site to be helpful with breaking down the core concepts.

We can think of the Kraken as taking on the role of a Firefighter. The "break glass in case of emergency" protector who comes out when we're in "danger."

Firefighters will do whatever they need to when it comes to stopping the danger, even pushing us into far more fraught situations. This can include things such as binge drinking, self-harm, serial cheating, and other actions we wouldn't rationally view as safe, but things like drinking can numb the pain, self-harm creates feelings of control, and cheating brings reassurance that you are wanted. They're quick fixes with a disregard for consequences in the moment, but they're actions done to "protect" you from danger.

But like I said, trauma can really skew your sense of danger.

Just because someone triggers your PTSD and brings out your greatest threat response, doesn't mean the threat is validated. In the same way flinching when your partner casually reaches out to touch you doesn't mean they're at risk of beating you.

Ed's response to Izzy could be an overreaction to Izzy's vague verbal threat, or it could be a solution to quelling Ed's fear of abandonment, or something else entirely. It could be reminding Ed of his father, but it doesn't mean that Izzy is an abuser. Especially within a context where we've never seen Izzy pose a physical threat to Ed, where the closest we got is him summoning the navy on his white boyfriend, and ensuring that Ed was not harmed in the interaction. Ed's use of physical violence against Izzy isn't proof of Izzy's abuse, no more than it would be for Ed throwing Lucius overboard.

Something Sarah Schulman goes into detail about with the necessity of drawing a difference between conflict and abuse is misidentification of abuse stemming from supremacy vs from trauma. With supremacy, you can't just trust your gut feelings because that ends up with things like white women having moc murdered. Traumatized responses are ones where past victimization interferes with our ability to differentiate between abuse and conflict. These can often overlap with clear borders, but there are differences, of course.

The reason people don't view this dynamic as abusive isn't from an unwillingness to see Ed as a victim, but from knowing that he has been victimized in the past. The level of trauma he sustained as a child severely fucks with someone's head. Not metaphorically either, it literally causes brain damage and has been linked to an increase in likelihood of developing autoimmune diseases. Like, trauma can be so bad that your body just starts eating itself it's fucking wild the amount of damage it can do to a person.

Recognizing that Ed’s actions can be wrong, but still extending empathy towards his place as a survivor of abuse, is an act of compassion towards him.

[plexxaglass]

Previous anon here. Where did I say Izzy Hands was perfect? Where did I say he had no flaws? Just because I don't think he's racist or homophobic doesn't mean I think he's a perfect baby angel.

And again, your interpretation is not canonical fact. You can insist it is, but "has bigoted intentions" is not observable outside of internal dialogue. Something a character says or does is canonical fact, reasons as to why the character says and does those things is interpretation.

"Izzy had three characters who are people of color lift the anchor" is observable fact. "Izzy made them lift the anchor because he's racist" is interpretation.

Personally, I don't think Izzy is racist because he's equally fucking awful to white people. He stabbed Stede, hit Pete, yelled at Lucius, and denied rations to Wee John. He is rude to quite a few people of color, but I think that's the result of being the character that is a jerk on a show that has a diverse cast. He's a jerk to people of color because those are the characters available to be a jerk to at the moment!

"I think there’s also something to be said for Izzy fans denying certain behavioral aspects" I have read this sentiment near verbatim from Izzy haters justifying harassing us. I wasn't frustrated when I sent that first anon, but I certainly am now.

What you've written comes off like "Izzy haters, I know we're all right about Izzy being homophobic and racist and Izzy fans know this and are willfully ignoring this, but it's still bad to harass people m'kay?" I don't think you're gonna get what you're hoping to achieve from that.

I apologize for frustrating you. I, frankly, feel like nothing I say will have you back down from insisting that I’m saying something dangerous or harmful.

Would you like me to walk back that he’s definitively racist or has exhibited racist tendencies? Okay. Your point is proven. I’ll recant that. He does, however, have internalized homophobia that is quite clear— and I honestly find that very interesting. Most Izzy Stan’s I’ve interacted with, agree with me on this, tbh. I don’t see it as an evil bad thing like Izzy haters do. I see it from a storytelling perspective as being a great way to introduce his backstory.

It seems you’re trying to make me out to be something I’m just not. I’m sorry that you’ve received abuse from Izzy haters. It’s unacceptable. But I’m not one of those people just because I see these characters as all having room for growth. And I think it’s a disservice to the fandom to see any of them as without room for development.

At any rate, I’ll continue to speak out in defense of Izzy fans and against any abuse thrown their way. You can feel free to see me as adding fuel to the fire, that’s fine. Doesn’t mean I won’t still stick up for you.

If you’d like to go off anon and message me privately, I’d be happy to continue this discussion, but I’m too old for this anon back-and-forth.

[ladyluscinia]

I know there's not much point to trying to address the "Izzy Hands is Kylo Ren" takes - they're not going anywhere, the loudest proponents already have me blocked, disagreeing probably mostly serves to get me blocked more, etc. - but they bother me a lot and I've got time and motivation right now...

So. Kicking a hornet nest. Halfheartedly. My argument is meandering and ends when I get bored of writing it. Under a cut because I'm not bothering to structure or trim this down.

I find this interpretation of the fandom response immensely frustrating for a few reasons. For one, I think it's rooted pretty heavily in an anti mindset that basically suggests giving positive attention to a "bad" character or ship as a fan is effectively stealing the attention you owe to a morally better one, and then casts suspicion on your motives. Asking "Why would you like Izzy so much when the pure and good Stede / Edward / Revenge crew are right there?" Accusing people of vilifying other characters if they suggest Izzy might have been wronged in any of the numerous interpersonal conflicts. Assuming the only explanation for sympathizing with him is bigotry (unconscious or otherwise) driving opinions... Which is an insane thing to just drop into discussion like it's obvious and unquestionable before we start introducing relevant concepts like "protagonist centered morality". I also, understandably, object to the take that since I don't write extensive disclaimers on how this character is pure bigoted evil, then the most generous interpretation (aka the only way I'm not a bad person myself) is that I'm just really stupid and do not understand the story. Or got distracted by a Victorian ankle collar flash and my ability to understand "this is a bad person" fell right out with my brain.

Like, fuck, people are not subtle with implying anyone who likes Izzy without a "oh but I also hate him and think he's pure villain" tacked on is either a moron or actively malicious, and problematic to the point of demanding public repentance either way. He's a fictional henchman in a pirate comedy.

And that henchman status leads into the main reason this take bothers me... I think it's just plain incorrect.

Ever since the very first time I saw someone arguing this - and responded to it in dissent as the author had invited people to do, though they did not appreciate someone actually taking them up on said invitation - my immediate complaint was that it hinges on taking the absolute worst faith read of every action Izzy takes from start to finish. Like, you can interpret all these things to mean what you say they mean, but it's hardly the only way and often not even the encouraged way. Example: the writers have openly stated they aren't trying to focus on homophobia and didn't intend the anchor hoist to be an example of Izzy being racially biased. It's one thing to declare the author is dead and keep reading those as inadvertently present in the text and relevant potential explanations regardless of intent. It's a whole different thing to decide that it is objectively wrong for fans to dismiss things like the anchor hoist as a coincidence (which it literally was) because you've decided the character is blatantly racist and that interpretations of his actions with less bigoted motivations are inherently unacceptable excusing of racism. For people that praise the writing so much, there is a lot of hostility to the idea that good writing on an antagonist might entail them being complex and maybe even - gasp! - not as evil as they could be. (Which Izzy very much isn't, btw.)

And on the specific comparison at hand, suggesting Izzy is effectively just Kylo Ren or Walter White or any number of white asshole characters that get idealized by fans ignoring that they are meant to be terrible... there's a pretty big elephant getting ignored. Namely, Izzy Hands is not a character with power. He's a henchman, with a much bigger, badder, scarier boss in Edward (who is on screen even more than he is). He isn't respected or feared by the Revenge crew. He doesn't have an institution of blatant symbolic and literal power backing him up like the Badmintons, despite this being a thing they very much could have done. Some of those extras in Navy uniform could have easily been, say, remaining Queen Anne crew, arriving at Izzy's heel to reinforce toxic pirate culture on Edward (who in this version is presumably traumatized by piracy and desperately trying to escape to a peaceful life). Instead Izzy is alone, and unthreatening, and written with both a noticable aversion to impulsive conflict violence and a fawn response. If these great writers were trying to do a Walter White style external harm and eventual self destruction arc to make a point about toxic masculinity, then this setup looks like they kinda really suck at it.

You can't write a character hitting the dramatic fall part of that narrative if they quite literally never get a leg up in the first place, and the fall is kind of integral to that group of toxic assholes. It provides the moral lesson / message that Izzy enjoyers keep being accused of being blind to. Unless, of course, you are suggesting that he's the "bad writers glorifying a power fantasy" version (more like Kylo Ren than Walter White), though I thought these weren't bad writers and it's a very strange concept of a power fantasy to be the butt of every joke.

You can't make any effective point about a toxic white guy with power without writing a toxic white guy with power. Like, idk, the Badminton brother who falls on his own sword because he's too haughty to take the person he bullied seriously??? Sure, nobody would have the point of Breaking Bad fly right over their head if Walter White had been a loser getting mocked relentlessly on screen and failing left and right, but something tells me "cancer patient who is a bit of dick goes bankrupt and dies, and nobody cares" wouldn't have made the points about toxic masculinity and hubris in the first place. If you want a real lack of media literacy, transplanting an arc and associated symbolism onto a character that doesn't fit the associated archetype and not addressing how it still works and sends the same message beyond assuring that it does is a good example.

I mean, seriously, these arguments are made by the same people who also relentlessly tear into the idea that Izzy is even slightly competent as a pirate. So they can't even pretend that his arc in the show is his fall of hubris (a dumb decision to start him in the show just after the climax turning point, but at least possible), because they are determined to remind you that he never had anything he thinks he's losing in the first place. How is that supposed to work??? Loser remains loser, gets embarrassed a bunch, says mean things that mostly get shrugged off, and look how dangerous and destructive toxic masculinity and arrogance is, kids!

That. Is. Not. His. Archetype.

For the thing that will really piss antis off, Izzy's whole comedic butt-monkey routine does give him a few archetypes he can lean into, and most of them are based around symbolic or literal victimhood. Like how he is kind of the designated toxic masculinity guy, and his life completely sucks for reasons often outside his control. Which does convey messages about how toxic masculinity isn't good for anyone, but in a way where the logical conclusion is that Izzy is also suffering under it and the logical arc (especially in a redemptive series) is to have the audience feel bad for him and root for him to get his own happiness by escaping it (you know... like what people think they are doing in a very flat way with Edward). There's also a semi-karmic element when his own actions backfire, but the endless humiliation conga makes that pretty sympathetic too (he's not successfully evil but still suffering plenty for it), and that puts him in the group of unthreatening antagonists who stumble right into the good side because being evil kinda sucks for them and they aren't as good at it as the other real villains. Think Zuko, or Spike.

Butt-monkey characters do tend to be more sympathetic than not. That's a comedy staple.

But sure, keep pretending he's more like Walter White or Tyler Durden than a character from The Office, and writing extensive posts on how liking the pure evil character you've made up in your head is proof of moral failing and / or idiocy. That's really a great use of time and fandom energy 🙄

Izzy will continue to be Just Some Guy

[the-irish-mayhem]

One of the mods shows up 15 minutes late with Starbucks. This week has been insane, BUT never fear! The stuff WILL get posed. This is for Fosterson Week Day 5: Throwback Thorsday. We’re fudging the timeline a little bit--imagine that the Thor movie took place around the same time/a bit after the first Iron Man movie in 2008. More of a sketch, a collection of moments than a true fic. (but there is something resembling plot here)

Loki never sends the Destroyer to Midgard.

Read on AO3.

destiny, disrupted

Here is a truth: Loki loves Thor.

Here is another truth: Loki also hates Thor.

Here is the most relevant truth: Loki loves his mother and respects her counsel above all others.

At the end of the day, this is what matters most. Odin sleeps on, Frigga advises her son how to rule, and Loki (mostly) listens.

Thor remains on Midgard. Mjolnir lays dormant in the desert, the magic patient and steadfast. The Destroyer remains in the Vault where it belongs, and the Warriors Three grudgingly accept Thor’s banishment; after all, Loki seems to be (mostly) listening to Frigga, and they are loyal to the throne. Heimdall watches carefully.

The realms continue to turn, Yggdrasil’s branches trembling in the galactic ballet.

Something is drawing near--but not yet.

Years later, he marries Jane in the desert where they met. The marks of the Bifrost have long since blown away by the sharp winds, but it still feels as close to his first home as he can get. It’s a small wedding, made up of the few friends they have plus Jane’s mom and officiated by a local Native American minister.

She throws her arms around his neck when they are proclaimed man and wife, she kisses him like he is her anchor, and he wonders how he ever thought he’d been in love before. He dips her dramatically, and she giggles against his lips. Their small audience applauds, Darcy wolf whistles, and Thor would never have thought he could ever be satisfied, could be happy, with something so small and humble, but it’s perfect, it’s wonderful, and he gets to call Jane Foster his wife.

He takes her last name--she never asked him to, but it seems apt, to Thor, to do it. He is no longer Thor Odinson. The name no longer fits him. His father is gone; his last action had been to cast his son out. It seemed almost appropriate, honorable even, to respect that last ruling by giving up his name. On Midgard, he is someone new. He isn’t the crown prince, he is simply a man. (A man who loves a woman more than life itself.) A new identity, a new life, a new beginning.

And so they begin life as Mr. and Dr. Thor and Jane Foster.

(Distantly, Thor hopes Heimdall has told his mother that her son has happily wed.)

(Distantly, Thor hopes his father would’ve been proud of the small life he is building.)

(And a small life--)

(It doesn’t seem so bad now.)

THEN

SHIELD had left several months after Thor’s arrival. Packed up the facility after it became clear nothing was going to move Mjolnir, and no new data would be gathered from it. Coulson left them a business card, which Thor talked Jane out of throwing away outright. (He knows that having SHIELD on their side might prove useful in the future, even if Jane continues to grumble about jack-booted stormtroopers stealing her life’s work.)

After almost a year, the agent following them finally left too.

Jane rebuilt, Thor helping where he was able, happy to simply be around her. Her energy was unlike anyone he’s ever known, vibrant and frenetic and with an unbridled intelligence that he thought his brother would’ve liked.

Their first kiss was on the roof, late at night with a fire in front of them, Thor pointing out where his planet would be.

“The light from my sun hasn’t reached us yet,” he had said.

“It might in about two thousand more years, if my estimates were right about distance,” Jane had replied.

She’d been looking up, using her hand like a galactic wayfinder of old to measure the stars. The fire glowed orange on her skin, illuminating her eyes like coals. She’s a supernova of her own making, and he’d always known there was something special about her, but in that moment, he’d been struck not just by her beauty in the gentle slope of her nose and cheekbones, but the effortless way she’d folded him into her life, the way she accepted his story--she’d run an estimate on distance because he’d asked her to in a fierce bout of homesickness. (And even if the answer wasn’t great, it was an answer, and then she’d reached out and held his hand and asked him to tell her about Asgard.)

When he kissed her on the rooftop, she didn’t seem surprised--she just leaned into him and let the embers between them spark into flames.

NOW

“It’s a letter from SHIELD.”

“Oh?”

“They want you to advise on a quote ‘top secret project of high scientific importance’ unquote.”

Jane snorts. “They can eat my shorts. It set my research back months to rebuild all my equipment they stole.”

“Maybe you should read the letter,” Thor offers.

Jane waves him off, returning to the small piece of equipment she’s slowly soldering together. “Don’t need to.”

“Shouldn’t you be wearing a mask?” he asks, concerned. “Those fumes can’t be good for the baby.”

She sits up a bit. “It’s only a bit of copper. But I’ll wear one if it makes you feel better.”

“It will.”

Jane gives him a small smirk and a wink as she stands from her station. She’s not showing much yet--she’s just barely out of the first trimester, but Thor can’t help but glance at her belly, at their little miracle.

He looks back to the letter. When Jane returns, mask in place, he says, “How much did you say the university was paying you for your research position?”

Her snort is even more incredulous than before. “Not enough.”

Thor glances down at the letter in his hand, and counts out the zeros after SHIELD’s base salary for the offered ‘long term advisory and research position.’

“I do think you should read this.”

She sighs, and holds out her free hand without looking up.

He can tell exactly when she reaches the “we hope this to be fair and adequate compensation for the services you will provide” portion of the letter based on her eyebrows jumping straight up and the soft “Holy shit,” falling out of her mouth.

“We did need to get out of the one bedroom before the little one makes an appearance,” Thor offers.

“Shit,” Jane says again. “We could forget that shitty two bedroom place we were looking at in Santa Fe.” It’s a soft comment, more of an idle observation than a commitment.

“So you’ll call them?”

“I’ll think about it.”

(She calls them that night, and is on a plane for an interview within 36 hours.)

THEN

In the early days of their courtship, he’d tried every job available to him. He’d worked construction, waited tables at Izzy’s, bartended, answered phones at the sheriff’s office, and sold secondhand furniture. In truth, he did not particularly hate any of these jobs--they just hardly seemed worthwhile to do for the rest of his life.

He’d been used to being significant in a way that being a human man couldn’t quite match. Going from galactically known prince and military leader of a planetary superpower to a small town bartender was a jarring transition, to say the least.

The only place he’d found where that feeling of insignificance faded was at Jane’s side. He’d never had an eye for the technicalities of magic, but he remembered enough from his schooling to be able to help her interpret some of what she was looking at; she was certainly clever enough to fill any gaps in his own knowledge.

“I could use another intern,” Jane had mused one day. Darcy had gone back to Culver after her semester with Jane had finished with six college credits under her belt and a promise to stay in touch.

(“How do you feel about student-teacher relationships?” he’d asked cheekily later on.)

(She’d slapped his shoulder, but given her lips on his not a moment later, he supposed that was his answer.)

NOW

Their new home is lovely. Jane had been added to SHIELD’s payroll two months ago, and they’d collected enough savings to put down a sizable down payment on a nice three bedroom house about a twenty minute drive from SHIELD’s base.

She still hasn’t managed to talk SHIELD into letting her bring him with her.

“They’re fishing for information about you, I know they are. They keep saying shit like ‘oh, your research assistant hasn’t cleared our background checks, but if you help us fill in the gaps, we can do something for you.’ Pffft. Like I’m going to fall for that.”

“And I’m only the research assistant?” he asks from his place by the stove, tossing his chopped bell peppers into the frying pan with the onions.

Jane rolls her eyes and plops down at the kitchen table. “Right? It’s not like they don’t know we’re married.”

“They literally helped me get my driver’s license that lists my name.”

She gives him a helpless shrug. “They have a lot of questions about where you come from.”

“Perhaps we tell them everything. Phil Coulson isn’t so bad, despite what you think.”

Jane growls. “Why you insist on being friends with him I’ll never understand.”

Thor shrugs and bends to check his roast in the oven. “He is a nice fellow.”

“A nice fellow who stole all my research.”

Their doorbell rings. Thor moves to answer it, but Jane flaps a hand at him. “No, no, I’ve got it. You’ve got dinner going.” She slides up behind him and hugs him around the waist, kissing his shoulder blade before stepping away. “Love you. Thank you.”

“You’re welcome,” he answers as she leaves the kitchen. He takes two plates from the cupboard and wonders who could be at their door. He has invited Coulson for dinner in the past (hoping that his wife would bury the hatchet once she got to know him), but he hardly seems like the type to show up if he hasn’t informed the hosts of his arrival.

He’s in the midst of carrying the plates to the table when Fandral, Sif, Hogun and Volstagg walk into his kitchen.

The plates slip right out of his fingers and smash against the tile floor.

(Once the fragments are cleaned up, his friends tell him what has transpired on Asgard in his years of absence. Loki lied, his father was never dead, and a few months ago emerged from the Odinsleep. Loki disappeared soon after, and they’ve heard disturbing rumblings about Loki partnering with the Mad Titan.)

(“We have reliable sources saying he’s hunting for something called the Tesseract,” Sif says.)

(“This Tesseract,” Jane says, “wouldn’t happen to be like… a small-ish, blue, glowing cube would it?”)

(“Yes, that exactly,” Sif says, surprised.)

(Jane winces. “I think I know where you can find it.”)

THEN

Jane liked to cuddle. Especially when she was sated and sleepy, her limbs would tangle around him like an affectionate octopus. It was one of those nights when she asked him, “Would you go back?”

“Hm?” he asked, mind addled by sex and the late hour.

“If you got the chance to go back to Asgard, be who you used to be. Would you take it?”

“I doubt I’ll ever get that chance.”

“Humor me,” she said, insistent in a way that tells him this is far more important to her than she’s willing to explicitly vocalize.

He stared at the ceiling in silence for a long moment, considering his answer, because she deserves a fully honest one.

“I don’t know,” he finally said. “I don’t think I could ever be who I used to be. I haven’t used magic in so many years, I feel like I can’t properly imagine it anymore.” He shifted to look at her. Her head was on his chest, and she steadily met his gaze, brown eyes wide and accepting. “The only way I can imagine going back is if I go back with you,” he said.

(Not long after that, they said I love you for the first time.)

(A half a year after that, Thor asked her to become his wife.)

(Inscribed on the inside of their wedding bands is the phrase Home is wherever you are.)

BREAK

When Jane shows up to the SHIELD base with her husband plus four honest-to-goodness Viking warriors at her back and requests to speak with Agent Coulson the agent on gate duty scrambles to fulfill her request.

While Jane handles the particulars of getting several guests in past security, his friends encircle him, staring at him like he’s a headless banshee. “What?” he asks.

“You’re married,” Hogan states, as though it’s obvious.

“I am.”

“And you’re expecting a child,” Sif says.

“Is there a point to stating the obvious?”

They all look at each other, and then back at him as though he is missing the obvious.

“The only one who was less likely to settle down was me,” Fandral says, an emphatic hand placed over his chest.

Thor shrugs. “I’ve changed.” He looks past them, to where Jane is emphatically gesturing at the agent who is clearly not moving fast enough in getting her what she wants and smiles. “She is everything I never knew I needed in a package I never expected.”

“I think it’s a good change,” Volstagg says proudly. “Becoming a father does tend to mature someone quite rapidly.” He steps forward to give Thor a hearty slap on the shoulder. Forgetting that his friend is no longer Aesir, the gesture nearly dislocates the joint and Thor struggles to stay on his feet.

“This new Thor, I like him!” Volstagg crows.

(The other three don’t look entirely convinced yet, but seem more or less willing to accept him as he is now.)

(Thor loves his friends--he knows them as well as anyone, and thinks that they will come to understand his new life.)

(He knows they want to ask if he will come home.)

(He knows what he will answer.)

THEN

“You don’t have any strong feeling about flower arrangements for the wedding, do you?” Thor asked.

Jane looked up from the book she was reading with a quizzical look on her face. “Uh, no? We’re getting married out in the middle of the desert.” She pauses. “Why? Do you?”

Thor had been idly browsing online and-- “This flower,” he had turned the screen to Jane and she leaned forward. “What is it called?”

“I think it’s a calla lily?” She squinted a little. “Definitely calla lily. They’re a pretty popular wedding flower.”

Thor hummed softly in contemplation. “Do you like them?” he asked.

“They’re pretty and they smell nice, so I guess.”

Thor went quiet for a moment, his eyes unseeing, and Jane bookmarked her book and set it aside. She scooted into his side on the couch and seemed to wake him from whatever spell he’d been under.

“Where did you go?” she asked.

“Just remembering,” he answered. “My mother liked to raise flowers. The palace gardens were almost entirely her handiwork. She was a talented sorceress, so she could’ve easily used her magic to make her garden as beautiful as it was, but she never did. She told me that sometimes the easiest thing isn’t the right thing.” He chuckled a bit at that. “She had lots of gardening life wisdom for us.

“Anyway, her favorite flower was the Queth Blossom. They look almost just like these,” he said.

“Then let’s get them for the wedding--I changed my mind, I have a very strong opinion about flower arrangements and I think they should be calla lilies.” Jane had said; he still remembers the way his heart leapt, and then melted, at her simple declaration. The way she simply said of course to something to remember his mother by. The way she could make him happy by just existing, by just being who she is.

(Jane would eventually tell everyone at the wedding who would listen that the flower arrangements were done in memory of his mother.)

(He loves her.)

NOW

The Tesseract is underwhelming at first, a shiny bauble like millions of others across the universe. Then it opens a portal and Loki emerges from the other side.

Underwhelmed is suddenly the least of Thor’s emotions.

Before Loki can stand and take in the room, Thor shoves Jane under a desk, praying to any deity that will listen that he doesn’t notice her. He can’t bring himself to hide with her. He has to speak to his brother, he has to know what--

“Loki!” Sif shouts.

Loki looks surprised, his attention pulled towards where the Warriors stand in formation with the SHIELD agents who approached the portal.

“Sir, please put down the spear,” calls out Fury.

A blast from the weapon takes down three agents before Thor can say anything.

“Loki! Stop!” Thor shouts, running from his meager cover behind the desk.

Loki knocks back the last of his opponents, downing even Sif and the Warriors with a power that is absolutely beyond anything he knew Loki possessed.

Loki’s eyes find Thor, and Thor barely recognizes the unhinged look in his eye.

“What happened to you?” Thor asks, a soft and genuine query because his brother looks unwell; gaunt, tired, and plain rabid.

Loki doesn’t answer immediately, just stalks forward like a predator.

“I started to see clearly for the first time in my life.”

There are other words, calmly spoken about a world made free from freedom, then Loki drops the visage Thor knows, his skin goes blue and his eyes go red and oh.

(Oh, Loki.)

Thor refuses to falter under the weight of this new truth that he can feel in his bones. He is not mine in blood, but he is my brother. “We were raised together, we played together, we fought together. Do you remember none of that?” Thor asks.

“I remember a shadow,” Loki says softly, stepping closer, skin still blue. “Living in the shade of your greatness.” He laughs. “And who could blame anyone for treating the Frost Giant like an invader who does not belong in his own home?

“And now you are but a man.” He snorts. “A pathetic, human man who can be killed just as easily as everyone else in this room.”

“Spare them,” Thor says. “If you want to take my life as recompense, then--”

(Just his small life. Just his small life with his wife, who he loves, and his unborn child, who he would do anything for. Just his one small life as Thor Foster seems--it seems too big to give up. His heart screams at the unfairness of it all.)

(It is too much to give, it is too much to lose.)

(But if he doesn’t offer to lose it, then everyone will die. He knows that.)

(There’s no such thing as just a small life, Thor knows in that moment. No life in this room is any smaller or bigger than his.)

(He feels like he wants to cry, but he will do it.)

Loki says, “Oh, but I could do that anyway. Besides,” a poisonous grin seeps over his face as he glances over Thor’s shoulder. “It looks like your wife is trying to make trouble for me.”

The floor drops out from under Thor as he looks back to see Jane typing furiously on the control unit that directly affects the Tesseract’s behavior. It’s sparking, just like it did when it opened to bring Loki here, and his brilliant wife is this close to being able to send him away--

Loki sends Thor into a wall with a flick of his fingers. Dazed, possibly concussed, but otherwise unhurt, Thor tries to stand, feels a scream inching out of his throat as he watches Loki magically drag Jane from behind the station.

Thor has never understood what made him worthy of Mjolnir in the first place.

He’d first picked it up in his youth, when he’d been emotional and his magic had been out of control-- Mjolnir had been a focusing point, something to channel himself through, something that felt like an extension of his connection to a storm. He’d been so busy trying to be the best warrior Asgard had ever seen, he’d never stopped to really think about what being worthy meant.

He learns what worthiness means in the space of a heartbeat.

He learns what it means the instant Loki turns his sight on Jane.

He reaches out, instinct, need, his magic reawakening, he does not know.

Mjolnir answers.

The hammer rips through the domed ceiling above them, and flies straight to his hand. The storm fills him once more and it’s only now that he has it back that he can feel the ache of its absence.

Loki, for the first time since he stepped into the room, looks scared.

Jane just grins.

(Later, when she gets the chance to examine the armor up close, she asks, “Is this how you normally looked?”)

(He answers, “More or less.”)

(She smiles like a woman who is absolutely going to ask him to wear his armor in bed later.)

(“It’s a good look.)

[uselessheretic]

people bring up death of the author in the most odd contexts while applying the term in a way that's entirely contradictory towards its meaning. i know ofmd fandom brings it up a lot when talking about the scene of izzy having the crew lift the anchor where fans interpret this as izzy's racist biases even though one of the writer's confirmed that this absolutely was not the intention behind the scene.

that doesn't stop it from being brought up in fandom discussions though where the topic turns to death of the author as a way of saying that this might not have been intended, but it's still how it came across as.

but death of the author isn't meant to be "if i disagree with the author's interpretation then i can just disregard it and know mine is the right one." it's the idea that an author's intentions and background doesn't mean their interpretation has more value than the reader's. which are similar, but really not the same thing?

especially when using death of the author to prioritize one fan's interpretation over another. the term puts forth the idea that there are multiple layers and meanings to one piece of writing, and its meaning is defined by the audience. the point isn't to assign a singular meaning that is upheld as the one true interpretation, and your reading of the scene holds no inherent value that is greater than another fan's.

but it's like? also not a thing where you can just? apply it when convenient to you and disregard when it's not? like you can't say something silly like "izzy isn't canonly queer and the creator's confirmation that he is doesn't count because death of the author." death of the author rejects a singular canon! if the viewers look at izzy and say "he's straight" then he's straight. if they look at izzy and say "he's queer" then he's queer. if you utilize this framework then both interpretations coexist at once where it's your responsibility as the viewer trying to analyze the text to consider the multiple readings of the character.

you just?? can't pull out death of the author as a way of telling other people how they're interpreting media wrong and that your interpretation is the singular correct way 😭

[something-about-sunflowers]

Izzy hands is definitely not a racist. I hate how there’s so much discourse over an actual fictional character rn😭. I am Māori and Afro-Latine and have detected literally no racism from his character. If we’re going to label anyone as racist it would be Stede due to his past w being an aristocrat or whatever the term is. But even then, there is no evidence.

The amount of dread that filled me seeing 'anonymous', 'Izzy Hands', and 'racist' in my notifs at a quick glance. . .

Anyway, yeah, like I'm super white so I know I'm not like. The best person to speak on it (though I believe we've mostly established that the Izzy Hate Anon is ALSO white sooooo. . .) but from my limited perspective, the only people in the show who are deliberately depicted being racist ('deliberately', because there is a Doylist explanation for the anchor raising scene that people like to cite), other than the people who get their shit rocked immediately for it, are Stede and Pete. And there is textual evidence for that, it's not interpretation, the native people literally call them both racist for SAYING something racist. (We'll ignore Stede’s wealth coming from his family plantation for the sake of 'it's not mentioned in the show so it's likely something they don't want us to be concerned with' but like. Izzy isn't the one who owned a plantation. And IMAGINING him coming from wealth to make that a possibility is not, in fact, canon. Or fair when Stede isn't held to the same standard anyway.)

Of course if you tell that to someone who is determined to hate Izzy No Matter What they'll ignore it. And they'll ignore that the very people who trapped Stede and Pete who called them out for being racist very much did not do that to Izzy and in fact did business with him (argue that 'it's because he had Fang and Ivan with him' and I'll point RIGHT at Oluwande).

Unfortunately this ask is likely to get accused of either: me sending it to myself (like we apparently do with the anon hate 🙄) or you lying about your race to justify not hating Izzy (or you being truthful but 'weaponizing' your race to make your 'interpretation' hold more weight, y'know, something the Izzy Haters NEVER do 🙄🙄🙄).

And mind, this isn't me hating on Stede or Pete, just pointing out the double standard and that the bare minimum threshold the show has for 'being considered racist' is something that Izzy doesn't reach.

[darkfire359]

I’m kind of surprised that it took this long for people to reply to this post and tell me that my post is bad and I should feel bad, et cetera et cetera. I did, after all, describe a thought experiment involving race-swapping, and I posted it on tumblr of all places.

I do want to clarify a few elements of this thought experiment though:

1. Do I think the backwards!OFMD world would be at all sensical or well-defined? No. As I stated in my original tags, obviously from both a historical and plot perspective, it would break down horribly. There would be plot holes galore and lots of the story wouldn’t make sense, absolutely, because OFMD’s story isn’t race-blind. But this isn’t an AU, it’s a thought experiment for some very specific points.

2. Do I think people of color are a monolith? No. I’ve actually gotten kind of annoyed about certain takes here for doing that and e.g. analyzing prejudice against Ed in the same way one would prejudice against a black person. But thought experiments benefit from simplicity (which this was already lacking), and the comparison in question was white vs non-white.

3. Does this hypothetical involve pretending Izzy isn’t white? Also no, the hypothetical was swapping everyone OTHER than Izzy. (This point is just an accuracy nitpick).

4. But it involves pretending that other people are / aren’t white? Yes. But this is already done implicitly in any discussion of racism. By definition, racism is about people being treated differently because of their race. So whenever racism is brought up, there’s already a vague, mini-hypothetical where you’re pretending someone is a different race, even if the only point is to say “they’d be treated differently in that case.”

5. Do the hypothetical discussions I include in my posts represent my own views (once you flip them back to regular OFMD)? No. I just think they’re commentary that some people in the fandom would say, in this thought experiment world. (In fact, I actively disagree with their reasoning—that’s the point.)

6. Then what’s the point of the post? I’m glad you asked, because I think a lot of people completely missed it. A lot of the discussion in the hypothetical world sounds absurd to us, because know that the conclusion has to be false. If we believe the hypothetical arguments, and we believe their conclusion (that backwards!Izzy is racist) then that would seem to imply that the real Izzy is biased against white people—and that doesn’t make sense.

So, there MUST be an error with the hypothetical arguments. In backwards!OFMD, the race-swapping is a premise, so it definitionally can’t be that. Thus, it’s either the case that the hypothetical people’s statements themselves are false (e.g. Jackie, Ed, Ivan, and Fang aren’t effectively the only people Izzy respects / has a positive relationship with), or the implication is false (Izzy wouldn’t be racist if he only respected / had a positive relationship with white people).

Arguing the first point is totally legitimate! I’ve seen some people do it (e.g. saying that the Mr. Lastname thing Izzy does isn’t condescending), but personally, it doesn’t sufficiently match my interpretation of the show. Which leads me to believe the second point—that Izzy wouldn’t be racist for exclusively respecting white people and exclusively punishing POC.

This is a surprising and unintuitive conclusion to get, IMO. The line between racism and non-racism is about intent (random dice-rolling could give a similarly skewed result without being racist), but a skew of that size at least feels like good evidence of intent. So, the fact that it isn’t is interesting, because it makes me reconsider how likely smaller skews (e.g. the three people raising the anchor all being POC) are to be racially motivated. Again though, it’s a just probability adjustment, not a statement that such a thing is definitely not racist.

Tagging other people who replied to me (?), at my own horrible detriment: @ourflagmeansgayrights, @meanmisscharles, @thetardigrape, @batsarebetterthanpeople, @chaotic-neutral-knitter (I don’t know the etiquette here, but my intuition is that it’s polite to tag the people involved in the discussion? Let me know if this is not the case, or just block me, or whatever.)

I’ve seen some discussion of whether or not Izzy is racist, but what I haven’t seen is discussion about whether or not backwards!Izzy is racist. Backwards!Izzy exists in an OFMD where all white characters have been swapped with non-white characters, and vice versa, except for Izzy himself. Let’s see what sort of discussion might exist in the fandom there:

Person 1: “Okay, can we talk about the fact that Izzy only respects white people? Literally everyone he has any kind of positive relationship with is white—Ed, Fang, Ivan, and Jackie.”

Person 2: “No kidding. And everyone he condescends to with that ‘Mr. Lastname’ thing is a POC—Lucius, Wee John, and Stede. We also see him slap Pete in the head for what seems to be no reason??? It’s like he singles out POC to punish or hurt in a way he never does with white people.”

Person 3: “But what about when he was working with the navy? They were all non-white.”

Person 1: “Yes, but it’s a ‘deal with the devil’ type of thing for him. He clearly doesn’t respect them and finds the idea of serving them disgusting—listen to that ‘you really want to lick the king’s boots?’ line. This isn’t an issue he has with serving under people in general, because as he says, he’s happy to serve Blackbeard.”

Person 2: “Yeah. Plus we see him encourage Fang and Ivan to shove the hostages around when he has them captured. He doesn’t like them at all.”

Person 3: [does not bring up the scene with Roach, Olu, and Frenchie raising the anchor, because a group of 3 white people being the ones to do a task wouldn’t be noteworthy.]

Person 1: “It’s unclear how much of a role Izzy played in the Kraken era decisions—Ed tells him ‘we have much to discuss’ but is clearly making the decisions himself. Still, Izzy seems happy to leave a bunch of POC to die and end up keeping two white people—Jim and Frenchie. Probably to add onto what is, like I said, a 100% white crew.”

————

The reverse of racism is not non-racism, but I feel like thinking about backwards!Izzy certainly shines an interesting light on the real Izzy.

[uselessheretic]

(this is just me offering an alternative interpretation so shhh)

if you shift the perspective a bit and cast away protagonist bias, there’s kinda a good argument for ”izzy wasn’t right to bully lucius, but also he wasn’t completely wrong either?”

on a ship, everyone works. in piracy, everyone works. one of the big themes throughout ofmd is the idea of piracy = freedom (not toxic masculinity i will die on this hill) which does go back to historical context. it’s really interesting to read about piracy and race because although pirates were not antiracist icons breaking down structures of white supremacy, pirate culture was radically far more racially equal in comparison. people escaping slavery often turned to piracy, and there was often direct democracies onboard of black pirates having a say in votes and equal split of bounties. (piracy was not perfectly antiracist please read more about it!)

a big part of this wasn’t from the goodness of pirates’ hearts, but because being on the sea necessitated this. it’s hard fucking work to run a ship and everyone works. there isn’t time for to be squabbling about race when the entire crew is constantly doing backbreaking labor that requires cohesion. along with that, most pirates were a mixture of sailors who were so poor they turned to piracy out of necessity, or former navy officers who just fucking hated the navy and decided to rob people instead. this forms a kinda smoothing of class boundaries because, again, there’s no time to be a bitch about money because everybody works.

so just think about this context and think about how izzy is very obviously working class and then it kinda… makes sense that he doesn’t find lucius ”i don’t clean things!” very charming. to be clear, i am in full support of lucius being a lazy gay who doesn’t do work and this makes izzy seethe but he can’t do shit about it and this is my life goal to achieve. but lucius is the only crew member on the ship who doesn’t do physical labor. and he doesn’t have to, he’s a scribe not a sailor, but this is a job that is born from class privilege that nobody else on the crew (other than jim) can hold because nobody else can read.

izzy is too strict and izzy is annoying, but he is consistent. (no, the hoisting the anchor was not supposed to be racially coded btw, wee john’s actor just has a bad back) everybody gets specific duties and everybody works and everybody agrees to that except for lucius who only takes orders from his rich boy captain. he doesn’t pick on lucius because he’s more feminine than black pete, it’s just that black pete shuts up and agrees while lucius goes sketches fang’s cock (icon icon icon)

it just? kinda makes a lot of sense that it pisses izzy off so bad when you consider the class dynamics at play. lucius is definitely not some super rich aristocrat! we know he did some pickpocketing back in the day (and it was not cute) but there is a certain level of class privilege necessary to have the skills that he does. the hardwork of piracy and running a ship is an equalizer where it doesn’t matter who you are, who you know, or who your daddy is: everybody works.

and having that blatantly disrupted and disrespected? and by some seductive twink with pretty lips who asks if you’ve ever been sketched and oh my god no you have not but what if––no no, you shant. all you can do is tell him to fuck off.